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Author Topic: Measurement wanted - BX carburettor  (Read 26625 times)
Harv
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« on: December 19, 2014, 02:15:04 PM »
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Ladies and gents,

In the background, I'm still pulling together some info on the Holden Stromberg carbs. I'll eventually put out a second addendum, which will compelte all the data for the single barrel Holden Strommies, some info on air filters and some info on pollution control gear.

One interesting hurdle I've hit is for the BX model. This is a later model carb, fitted to LX and UC Toranas, HX and HZ Holdens and the VB Commodore. Unlike most Strombergs, the BX does not have a number after the letters (unlike say the grey motor BXOV-1). The number determines the flange bolt spacing of the carb:
o 1 – S.A.E. nominal size 1” flange with throttle barrel diameter of 1 3/16" and 2 3/8” bolt spacing (often referred to as a “Size 1” flange) ,
o 2 – S.A.E. nominal size 1¼” flange with throttle barrel diameter of 1 7/16" and 2 11/16” bolt spacing (often referred to as a “Size 2” flange),
o 3 – S.A.E. nominal size 1½” flange with throttle barrel diameter of 1 11/16" and 2 15/16” bolt spacing (often referred to as a “Size 3” flange),
o 4 – S.A.E. nominal size 1¾” flange with throttle barrel diameter of 1 15/16” and 3 5/16” bolt spacing (often referred to as a “Size 4” flange), and
o 5 – S.A.E. nominal size 2” flange with throttle barrel diameter of 2 2/16” and 39/16” bolt spacing (often referred to as a “Size 5” flange).

I'm not sure what the bolt spacing and throttle bore of the BX carbs are, but suspect that they are "Size 3".

Does anyone have a BX carb that they can measure the bolt spacing and bore for me please?

Regards,
Harv
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mcl1959
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« Reply #1 on: December 19, 2014, 03:36:16 PM »
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I have a BXUV and a BXV carb, these are not want you want I assume.

Ken
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Harv
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« Reply #2 on: December 19, 2014, 05:56:56 PM »
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Thanks Ken, but no I need just the BX carb. It is wierd in that every other carb that Stromberg made they included the "1", "2", "3" etc to show the size (eg BXV-2), just not on the BX... even in the genuine Stromberg literature. It was around that time that everyone was going metric... maybe that had something to do with it.

Cheers, and thanks again,
Harv
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fe350chev
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« Reply #3 on: December 19, 2014, 10:39:53 PM »
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I think I read that a BX was economy so might be a straight bw made by bendix when nobody else made them anymore to bridge a gap for the new adr rules til injection saved the day for Ford and holden. From memory I read that it was only on manuals and not autos with a different throttle posOrion too. Manuals took longer to heat up due to no resistance from the auto at idle.  But can't remember the choke difference physically etc. Basically your looking at the xd falcon 200/250cid and cortina etc. Same 1 7/32 and the standard flange as in the fuel miser kit. I thought Ken might like some links too. http://classiccarbs.com.au/Stromberg-BX-BXV-Falcon-XC-XD-Cortina-TD-TE-TF-Fairlane-ZJ-Holden-HX-HZ-Torana-LX-UC-Commodore-VB-O-H-Kit-900.2-0018A-

This thread has list of strommies.

http://oldholden.com/node/77451

http://203.222.103.244/forums/pop_printer_friendly.asp?TOPIC_ID=24507

http://m.ebay.com.au/itm/151520511464?cmd=VIDESC&gxo=true

https://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=3&ved=0CCEQFjAC&url=http%3A%2F%2Fcarburetor-manual.com%2Flibro%2FStromberg-Condensed-Catalog-ocr.pdf&rct=j&q=xd%20bx%20carby%201%207%2F32%20flange%20size&ei=OQuUVNf4PIXRmwWF8oIg&usg=AFQjCNHEzLIHqItUocqYDXaKR_arE9_WaQ&bvm=bv.82001339,d.dGY



http://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/154333/post/1121475/
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Deano

Current Rides: 1958 "Black and White Taxi" FC special Sedan, 1957 FE special Sedan, BA Futura,  2015 VF Commodore, 1956 Austin Tipper Truck
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« Reply #4 on: December 19, 2014, 11:03:21 PM »
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Some more info specific to the bx no number carby. Reason why is cos Ford, Chrysler etc used the same type.
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Deano

Current Rides: 1958 "Black and White Taxi" FC special Sedan, 1957 FE special Sedan, BA Futura,  2015 VF Commodore, 1956 Austin Tipper Truck
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« Reply #5 on: December 19, 2014, 11:17:55 PM »
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Just to prove the flange is same and the 1 7/32 as well here's a Ford vs Holden kit. 😱.
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Deano

Current Rides: 1958 "Black and White Taxi" FC special Sedan, 1957 FE special Sedan, BA Futura,  2015 VF Commodore, 1956 Austin Tipper Truck
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« Reply #6 on: December 19, 2014, 11:54:47 PM »
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it flowed about 210cfm

You may be interested in this improvement notice
http://classiccarbs.com.au/Stromberg-BOV-2-BXV-BXUV-3-BX-and-WW-Idle-Screw-Replacement-Kit-Cortina-Falcon-Holden-Commodore-900.159-012A- it cured idle problems.

And this. Harv, it's an extremely interesting read this one about all sorts of useless but interesting info that I like.

http://fordsix.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=42249
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Deano

Current Rides: 1958 "Black and White Taxi" FC special Sedan, 1957 FE special Sedan, BA Futura,  2015 VF Commodore, 1956 Austin Tipper Truck
Harv
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« Reply #7 on: December 20, 2014, 08:11:04 AM »
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I think I read that a BX was economy so might be a straight bw made by bendix when nobody else made them anymore to bridge a gap for the new adr rules til injection saved the day for Ford and holden. From memory I read that it was only on manuals and not autos with a different throttle posOrion too. Manuals took longer to heat up due to no resistance from the auto at idle.  But can't remember the choke difference physically etc. Basically your looking at the xd falcon 200/250cid and cortina etc. Same 1 7/32 and the standard flange as in the fuel miser kit. I thought Ken might like some links too. http://classiccarbs.com.au/Stromberg-BX-BXV-Falcon-XC-XD-Cortina-TD-TE-TF-Fairlane-ZJ-Holden-HX-HZ-Torana-LX-UC-Commodore-VB-O-H-Kit-900.2-0018A-

Thanks Deano - appreciated. One of the FB/EK forum guys has measured a BX for me overnight - they are an SAE Size 3 flange as suspected (SAE 1½” size cross flange with 2 15/16” bolt spacing and 1 9/16" throttle bore). Venturis for all the GMH BX's were metric 31mm (near enough to 1 3/16").

The BX was not an economy carb - it was the normal carb used for LX Torana through to VB Commodore on all the inline sixes, both auto and manual. Like everything post-HJ, it was a pollution carb (sealed vents and all the other dramas). It was replaced in the VC-VK Commodore sixes by the GM Strasbourg Varajet carb prior to losing carburettion to injection from VL onwards.

Cheers,
Harv
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fe350chev
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« Reply #8 on: December 20, 2014, 09:41:18 AM »
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Yeah I just posted stuff on it, I don't know a lot about specs and I probably shouldn't have said economy cos the word I was after is adr compliant or whatever ppl call them. I think most ppl wouldn't think that a ww dual throat is more economocical than a single but you know how it is. It was late and I just thought I'd post up interesting links. Forget about any specs I said cos I was trying to get into all the different configurations but by no means do I know about them all. I don't think the varajet ones were trouble free hey. Stuff got blocked and little pipes and stuff. Now you got me wondering what type is on my austin truck! With all this reading about carbs I might get an itch I don't need atm. In the eBay kit above, which flange is it related to? The earlier 202 or another one? What I wrote about the fuel miser kit with 1 7/32 or what I said I should have just said I thought the flanges were same cos there's too many body types and one can never assume the original is on there or not a custom build. So don't go by specifics anyone but I thought the link had interesting points in them.
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Deano

Current Rides: 1958 "Black and White Taxi" FC special Sedan, 1957 FE special Sedan, BA Futura,  2015 VF Commodore, 1956 Austin Tipper Truck
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« Reply #9 on: December 20, 2014, 11:38:21 AM »
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Harv, I would like to see some info on the Varajet  .I was running just a single barrel strommy 'til about 18 months ago when after spending quite some time on a mates XU1 side drafts I decided to try one of these Varajets on my 179 . So I got a cheap one off ebay ,cleaned it up and made myself an adaptor plate to put it on a Holley manifold . The motor has a stock cam but extensive head work and I found single strommy wouldn't give enough air at revs and larger carbs would run sooty at low revs . The Varajet seemed to get a bad reputation but I'm not sure why . Do you think it was because of the electric fuel solenoid and the electric choke ? I am very happy with the result and performance of this modification on a small mild red motor . Haydn
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Harv
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« Reply #10 on: December 20, 2014, 11:52:59 AM »
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G'day Haydn,

I've got a heap of info at home on the Varajet, though am on the road for work at the minute.

I suspect that the Varajet suffered like most carbs from fiddlers curse, as well as a good dose of Holley envy. Being the new kid on the block, they did not have the availability of tuning gear like SUs, Holleys and Strommies. They are supposed to flow some 375-400cfm@3"Hg, much better than the WW's 280cfm.

Cheers,
Harv
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« Reply #11 on: December 20, 2014, 01:57:35 PM »
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As someone who didn't grow up with carby cars (I'm in 30's) I like reading about what some of you might remember or take for granted. So forgive my enthusiasm for having to read more than experienced it. But I did looking into it a lot with my first car, a rare xb Fairmont gs with 250 2v. Although these engines didn't come with many xb's, some were fitted to the xb that not many ppl believe. But anyway it went fantastic. That had a Stromberg, perhaps the bigger jet One. I ended up doing a 351 for it. That was mid 90's. I was researching the WW at the time. But ended up using a xe falcon carb. But that was a 250. I wish I never sold that head now. It was my old man's car for years and off the lights it was a very quick car off the line. Sometimes going too big ruins the around town takeoff. I think ppl need to learn to drive these things too. Like, if you progressively modulate the throttle instead of planting it, it works better. Probably cos the accelerator pumps on a lot of these older stromies wouldn't flood it and bog down. At my age I don't want a car that I just start like an ls motor and it's all perfect. I want to have a play. I hear a lot of people talk about their first hand experience that that 80's period of holdens. I really didn't like much of that era of Aussie motoring. I prefer Ford's from 76 to say 88. I think Holden sat on their hands during that period and sort of took their loyal buyers for granted. But I'm led to believe that there were import and exchange rate issues and recession at the time. Lucky they kept v8's going really. I don't think the early commodores are very appealing. Thats my opinion anyway. I like pre 76 cars more. But I suppose that's cos I didn't exist pre 76 lol.
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Deano

Current Rides: 1958 "Black and White Taxi" FC special Sedan, 1957 FE special Sedan, BA Futura,  2015 VF Commodore, 1956 Austin Tipper Truck
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« Reply #12 on: December 20, 2014, 07:12:28 PM »
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I wasn't really thinking about 3.3 but more about adapting Varajets to smaller holden 6's all I meant was with the small primary and the large secondary it works much better and cleaner than my previous 350 Holley and Webber set ups on my 179 .




Haydn
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« Reply #13 on: December 20, 2014, 09:37:43 PM »
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Yeah I can imagine. Best of both worlds.
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Deano

Current Rides: 1958 "Black and White Taxi" FC special Sedan, 1957 FE special Sedan, BA Futura,  2015 VF Commodore, 1956 Austin Tipper Truck
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« Reply #14 on: December 21, 2014, 09:56:56 AM »
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The Holley has it's place - simple bit of kit, reliable, easy to get parts for, simple to work on. For a red, it's an OK carb but can be quite boggy, even with the venturi restrictors. Better suited to something running mid-to-full throttle all the time... think speedway rather than traffic light racer. The Webers are nice carbs, but pricey and harder to get parts for. The Varajet is a nice compromise. Mechanically more complex, and can be tricky to get parts for... but built beautifully. The 35mm primary is a lot smaller (half the size) than the twin 1 3/16" plates in a 350 Holley, so initial response is crisper. The only downside is the mechanical secondary... I prefer vacuum but thats just me (and my heavy right foot  Grin).

Cheers,
Harv
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« Reply #15 on: December 21, 2014, 11:04:55 AM »
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Yeah harv, crisper throttle is what I got from the 250 2v with an intermediate carby.
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Deano

Current Rides: 1958 "Black and White Taxi" FC special Sedan, 1957 FE special Sedan, BA Futura,  2015 VF Commodore, 1956 Austin Tipper Truck
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