How much oil should there be coming from rocker arm and lubebush

[john253a]

Just done a head gasket (blew out between 3 and 4)
Changed it and now I'm redoing the valve clearance hot

And I only get a dribble out if the joining bush in startup then nothing
Even at 2500rpm nothing

I checked the hole was clear

I've blown air up the hole and it comes out from each rocker arm and that lube hole on bush

I've ran motor with the oil pipe disconnected and I only get it to dribble, spit, dribble, spit coming out at idle
When it spits or shots out it only comes out about 3-4mm
And is about 1 second off 1 second on

Is this correct
Doesn't sound right to me but you never know

[mcl1959]

It is low but it is also surprising just how little oil is needed up top to keep it lubrictaed.
If you have long term plans for the motor you should address the issue - probably oil pump needs rebuild

Ken

[john253a]

Pulled the side plate off
Disconnected the pipe from block at lifters
And started

at idel is spray up about 3/4"
At 25-3000 it is a constant flow spraying as high as the middle of head

Blew out pipe and refitted with top not on rocker arm
And now just a constant drizzly

Pluged it all up and ran
And oil comes out joiner bush
But none out of rocker arm

My book showed hole to face bottom at 45deg facing carbs
Is this correct

[john253a]

Thanks for the speedy reply ken

[Trevor_B]

Hi John,
Many people (self included) like to put a screw in the hole in the joiner block and so force all the oil along the pivot shafts. That way you get the best possible lubrication to the rockers.

When I restarted an old engine after it had been sitting for a couple of years it took about 5 minutes before the oil got to all the rockers.

Also, you could put an oil pressure gauge at the oil pressure light outlet on the block to check the condition/pressure of the pump (then take it back off if you don't want it there). I would do that before pulling it out to reco as the oil pump parts (gears & relief valve) are almost impossible to get. If you do need to reco it there is a way to use red motor gears but it requires a small amount of machining - I have the details if you need them.

Cheers,
Trevor_B

[john253a]

Thanks Trevor
I might do the block off because I know I'm getting it out there as a constant

As far a new gears and relief
They are available
Just no gears today

This is the email I got from auto surplus

Hi John,
 
Gears are not available but we can supply a relief valve and spring for $17.50. We will have complete kits in approx. 3-4 months.
The kit will come with shaft, gears and the relief valve and spring.

[ardiesse]

John,

I've just done an engine rebuild and spent a good while mucking around with the oil feed to the top-end of the motor.

The previous owner had put a self-tapper in the relief hole of the centre fitting like Trevor said, and in that state the oil came out of each rocker arm even at idle.  But there was a lot of carbon buildup on number six piston crown and around number six inlet valve, and that was after only about 10000 miles.  So I have left relief hole open this time.  And now I have to run the motor at about 2000 rpm to get oil flow out the rocker arms.  Which is ok at highway speeds.

It's worth knowing that the oil feed to the rocker assembly doesn't come straight from the main oil gallery.  Instead, it's taken from the number three camshaft bearing.  This is where things get interesting.  The number three journal on the camshaft has a groove machined in it, but the groove isn't machined all the way around the journal.  As the engine turns over, the groove in the camshaft journal only allows oil to flow up to the rocker assembly when it's in the right position.  That may only be for 90 - 120 degrees of camshaft rotation (read a quarter to a third of the time).

My two cents' worth: block the relief hole in the centre fitting if you're only doing short drives in city traffic.  If you are getting a "fountain" of oil out of the fitting by the cam followers at 2500-3000, then your oil pump's fine.  Just make certain that there's no sludge inside the rocker shafts to prevent oil from reaching the rockers.

And one other (often overlooked) thing: reface your rocker arms on an oilstone.  I learned the hard way that if you don't, you chew out the edges of the valve stems.

Rob

[john253a]

Thank that explane the on/off/on of the oil at idle

So since you unblocked the bleed you don't get carbon buildup?

[ardiesse]

John,

Way too early to tell yet.  I've only had the motor back in the car for three weeks so far.  I'll have to guess carbon buildup from the oil consumption, and how much crud builds up on the spark plug electrodes.

Rob

[john253a]

Wonder if anyone has turned it around so as it comes out top at 45deg that way more oil sits in there giving it more of a chance
But I think it there to lube the lifters earlier

[zulu]

On one of my engines it turned out the reason I had no oil to the rocker gear, was because the engine reconditioner was unaware     that he needed to line up the hole in the cam bearing with the groove in the journal

Long story short, he fixed it but guess who had to remove and replace the engine, not happy

Gary

[MalFE]

If you take the side plate off again remove the oil feed pipe and also the brass fitting on the block.
You will be able to see the camshaft or maybe the bearing has turned partially restricting flow.
(I did this with Garry's car to discover the bearing was incorrectly fitted).

Mal

[ardiesse]

Mal and Gary,

I'm curious now to find out how you fixed the problem.  Obviously you had to remove the rocker gear and followers, and then the camshaft, but would it then have been possible to send a drill down through the pipe fitting and drill a new hole in the cam bearing?

Or did you have to press the bearing out and re-install it the right way around?

Rob

[john253a]

I removed the pipe behind side plate and I was able to get oil to spray up to bottom of head with no pipe at around 2-2500rpm so my pressure is good
I flushed the pipe with solvent and blew it clean
I get a lot more from hole now but compaired to newer cars it is so little
If I block off the hole with my finger I get oil from the rockers
So I just left the hole think the way it should be and that's why asked about turning it around so as it fills up the rocker a tad more

There will be new pump rebuild kits avaible throught surplus soon
So if she doesn't sell ill do some more invergating
 

[zulu]

Rob,

Mal was a great help, proving that there was no way the oil could exit the source

The bloke who reconditioned the engine had to disassemble everything and replace the bearing/s

After I refitted the engine Mal checked the rockers and shafts and all was good bar for 1 rocker not getting any oil which we replaced, all good now

Gary