Gas or Gasless

[Not Happy Jan]

Could somebody please enlighten me as to the pro's /con's of each. Looks like I got a bit of rust repairs to do
And using flux wire with gas

[FCRB26]

whatever you do go gas otherwise you are trying to weld light panels with big flux cored wire.

Buy a nice 190 amp mig dont go any smaller or you will regret it.
 get a quality brand mig as the coils in the cheaper brands shag out pretty quick.
I sell a nice migomag 190 for  $1200 ish and all my mates are happy with them.
migomag monomig kemppi are all good CIG are now just rubish plastic feed wheels ect.

If you get something nice like that run 0.6mm wire dont use 0.9mm it just needs to much heat to melt it and you will blow more holes 0.6 you can turn it right down and weld nice.

all your bunnings hardware welders are toys and rusbish go to a welding shop and pay the little extra for a quality set up.

you may think i will never need a bigger unit like a 190 but you get more welding settings that the smaller units.

i might upset a few but flux cored wire is for cocky farmers not car repairers ..


Pete

[Gary C]

Hey Pete while on the subject of mig wire is there a "soft" wire available? I use the .6mm with gas and when welding a patch into a panel the weld is a lot harder to manipulate than the original panel, if you know what I mean.
Thanks, Gary.

[FCRB26]

No theres not the only way it could be harder is if you cool it with a wet rag it will harden a bit but other than that im not sure whats going on.

pete

[fe350chev]

rather than list a favourite, what sort of .6 wire should we steer clear of for panel/chassis work?

[FE 4 ME]

Pete,
        clearly you know your stuff, i've seen someone using co2 with their MIG welding on a car resto, what's your take on using CO2 gas opposed to Argon .....??

i'm thinking CO2 is the go, as it's much cheaper to re-fill and you own the bottle so no rental..the only difference i seen was you need to push the wire deeper into the weld when starting to ensure heat penetration, than the rest is as per normal.....

be great to know what you think


"Have a Great Holden ( FE ) Day !! " 

FE 4 ME

[FCRB26]

i actually have not used co2 i know the laser cutters all mix there gases with co2 so they use less of the expensive stuff.


I suppose as long as its a shielding gas it should work ok.

I get G size bottles for $60 exchange so they last all my mates a pretty long time now so we have never looked at a cheaper alternative...


I can ask the welding mob what there take is on it.

[FE 4 ME]

Cheers fchoon
   ...It would be handy to know, as ive already got a CO2 bottle, be good to find out before i go the outlay or mistakes...mind you its just a matter of connecting it the my MIG and practise...im not the world's best MIG welder, but from plenty of experience with oxy and lesser with arc welding, it is a tad easier to control than arc, so its all about practise i guess, like MOST things...im on the hunt for some old unrepairable gaurds to chop up and practise my welds... but like all things it's best to heed advise rather than go at it like a bull at a gate.....

I do have flux coated wire, which was what i intending to use..... wouldnt flux wire be better for outdoor welds ?, such as working on a car outside...wouldn't wind effect the gas protecting the weld

thankx for your advise fchoon

"Have a Great Holden ( FE ) Day !! " 

FE 4 ME

[FCRB26]

the problem with flux cored its always larger diameter and you have to get more heat into it to melt it and it blows holes.

Another good practice pull your liner out and blow it back from handpiece end thru get the crap out also put some lube on your rollers and make sure they spin free and are not gummed up.

[fe350chev]

this is all very useful.

[FE 4 ME]

Thankx fchoon,
  i will do that, the MIG has been sitting in the shed for awhile and I'm sure there could be plenty of dust and stuff inside it...will do a good clean out b4 i zap things


just a note, i have a new sealed coil of 0.8mm flux wire..so this wont do the job  ??


FE 4 ME   

[FE 4 ME]

Also fchoon,
    i havent checked it out yet ( being 9.30pm heheh  ), what's involved in pulling the liner out ? is it a question of pulling the handpiece apart and going from there ? or is it more simple than that or there are other tricks involved ??

cheers 

FE 4 ME

[fe350chev]

http://fefcholden.org.au/forum/index.php/topic,6422.0.html

Not happy jan - the above link has a lot of discussion that I was reading. Its really hard with welding cos each machine is different and every welder has their own ways, its a bit like bloody spray guns!

[FCRB26]

0.8 is just a bit harder as like flux cored you need more heat try it but buy a small roll of 0.6 and try that heaps of difference.

Depending on your mig to remove the liner detach the handpiece from the mig take your tip and gas diffuser out and where it screws onto the machine there will be a brass nut undo it and simply full the liner out.

[FE 4 ME]

Thankx for your info fchoon,
    when it stops raining i will go and check it out...can you get .6mm flux wire ? or is .8mm the smallest ?

hehehe does anyone want to buy a full coil of .8mm flux core wire    

"Have a Great Holden ( FE ) Day !!! " 


FE 4 ME

[FE 4 ME]

You know i was just thinking i might get off this computer and get my butt down to gasweld or BOC and talk to the techs ( after i check out my MIG )

but indeed thankx for your input...it's been a gr8 help

" Have a Great Holden ( FE ) Day !!! "    Me Holden mates

FE 4 ME

[FE 4 ME]

Well it stopped raining and now i have the secs on my MIG...it's a Migmate turbo 105.... so i gather this is only a 105 amp

cant find the manual, so now i will search online and see what i can find, but im sure the 105 must mean Amps

will this MIG cut doin some panel work ?

im hoping it will, as i will also be using it to weld up a frame for a large gate, if not its my arc welder... but would prefer to test out the MIG

hope this MIG will be good enough for panel work

please let me know your opinion  fchoon and others


cheers


"Hope you Have A Great Holden ( FE ) Day !!! " 


FE 4 ME

[Ed]

+1 for the MigoMag.

I've been using a MigOMag 195 for 10 years and it has never let me down. good adjustability and easy to use.

1200 is a good deal on those Pete. I paid alot more than that.

use Argoshield light and 0.6mm wire as you get better welds, less spatter.

forget gasless.

105 isn't necessarily related to strength, check the duty cycle for that.

60% @ 105A etc would mean it can weld for 6 mins out of 10 for example at that strength before needing a rest.

One more thing is a mate of mine thought bigger was better so he went and bought a second hand Migomag 240.  He then had to change everything (feed rollers etc) to suit smaller wire and the lower settings don't have enough comparable fine tuning for sheet work.  Great if you do 2 - 10mm all the time, not as good for 1mm work (compared to the 195)... He would have been better off buying the right size machine IMO.


Cheers

Ed

[FE 4 ME]

Thankx for your input ED,
               

I just checked the MIG Specs written on the side and it says as follows :-


  Rated output current 25% cycle at 50 Amps
          Rating of supply flexible cord 10 Amps
      Max. short circuit input current  37 Amps


the manual isn't much more info, its more about set up for multiple models, set up and problem solving...that's pretty much it !!

thankx all for your help......


FE 4 ME         


Sorry- Not Happy Jan..... I'm not trying to steal your thread, im just glad you posted it on here, i need the help as well...MIG's are like a world of their own.... even fine tuning looks like is fun in itself

thankx Not Happy Jan for bringing this topic up and the helpful info ive got out of it



so will this be ok for the odd weld here and there ?, maybe weld a patch in here and there, i dont need it for any major Resto work, but would be gr8 to use it for the odd body work here and there......

[Ed]

As Fchoon suggested,  try buy the best welder for your budget.

My first cheap welder led to nothing but disappointment and poor quality work.  It was an SIP110 or similar and it would continually go over temp and cut out and the welds had poor penetration because of the lack of grunt. there is no way it would do anything structural.

Once you have a welder you will find alot more to do than just car jobs.

I fear this little machine  25% at 50A will run out of puff quite easily.

While it will do the odd 1mm sheet maybe 2mm job, it's size will be the main limiting factor and it wont take long to find it's limits.


Cheers

Ed