FE-FC Holden Discussion Forum

Ladies and Gents,

The aim of this post is to collect firm orders for a new, better grey motor cylinder head gasket.

The link below shows some pretty detailed work by one of the FE/FC Holden forum members: http://forum.fefcholden.club/index.php?topic=26399.0
The upshot of it is that in 1963 GMH issued a Service Note AN 1627, which gives a revised head gasket, part number 7424869.  The new head gasket results in an increased flow of cooler water to the rear cylinders and valve seats, and is designed for use on vehicles operated at prolonged high speed or under conditions where severe operating temperatures are experienced. The “normal” grey motor gasket has 38 holes punched in it, in addition to the 6 large cylinder bore holes. The 7424869 gasket has 12 of the 38 small holes left blank (unpunched) to change the water flow through the cylinder head. The gasket is used in conjunction with some simple enlarging of the rear water jacket holes in cylinder head and cylinder block. To upgrade your standard grey motor cooling, you remove the cylinder head, do some very simple drilling (very achievable in a back yard), and use the new gasket.

Note that the standard gaskets sold over the counter by Repco, SuperCheap etc are not the better-cooling 7424869. To the best of my knowledge, the 7424869 gasket is not available, other than a few NOS survivors. The work done on the FE/FC forum shows that the 7424869 gasket changes really work.

My intention is to get a run of the 7424869 gaskets made (I want one anyway for my meth-monster grey motor project  ;D). AA Gaskets in Melbourne is willing to make the gaskets up, though we would have to pay for tooling, as well as cover a minimum run of 50 gaskets. The indicative cost of the gaskets will be $70, plus postage. As a sense check, a standard head gasket from eBay is $35-60, depending on quality (the AA Gasket type quality is around the $60 mark).

I'm going to act as the focal point for an order, similar to what I did with the hydramatic service kits. I'll raise a separate post on each of the FX/FJ, FE/FC, FB/EK and EJ/EH forums, calling for nominations on who wants a gasket. I'm not doing FaceBook (me and FaceBook don't talk), but happy if anyone wants to spruik a link to the forums. I'll let the nominations run for two weeks (end of January), and hope we get 50 nominations. I assume some blokes will want two or three, and I'll probably take 5-10 (some for me, and some for the inevitable latecomers  ::)). Provided we get 50, I'll place the order then manage the distribution. Not sure how I'll post these out without them getting bent... need some advice here please. If someone can scan me up a good copy of the GMH Service Bulletin, I'll include a print of that too in each parcel.

If you would like one (or more) of the 7424869 gaskets, please post here, and PM me your name and address. I’m going to take this as a firm commitment on your part to pay $70 plus postage.  I’ll collect up the nominations, and see how we go by the end of January.

Cheers,
Harv

2 x please Harv. PM sent.

I will take 2

Regards

Wayne b

Thanks for your efforts Harv, I'll take one as well?
Jim

Hi Harv,

Thanks for your commitment I will take 2.

Cheers
John

Hi Harv,

Can I pleased increase my order by 2 being a total of 4 thanks.

Cheers
John

Hi Harv,
I will take 2 also please.
Cheers,
Graham

I will take one please Harv, i have sent you a PM, Fraze

Harv put me down for 2 please.

Hi Harv,

I to would like to have 3 head gaskets. I will PM my details.

Regards Mick

Harv,

Ten, please.  Plus extra incentive (see pm).

Rob

Interest in the gaskets has been fantastic. I now have 50 nominations spread over the various early-Holden forums, so it looks like the project is a goer. I'll start some more detailed conversations with AA Gaskets.

In the meantime, I'll keep collecting nominations until the end of January. The more nominations, the cheaper it is for us all.

As a word of warning, I'm only doing this once. I intend to buy enough gaskets for my own personal use, with few spares. If you want one of these gaskets after this batch, you'll need to organise a special run with AA gaskets yourself. AA Gaskets will still have the tooling, but may not want to stop their production process to make you 1 or 2 gaskets.

Cheers,
Harv

I will take 2 myself please.

Harv
I'm interested! Before I commit to a number I will bring it up at next weeks SA club meeting (24th) with the view to combine an order if others from the club are interested.
Cheers
Dan

Harv,

One order from the 48 & FJ Holden Owners' Club.

Rob

Thanks Dan.

Thanks Rob - I'll add their order to the list.

Hi Harv,

Can I pleased increase my order by 1 being a total of 5 thanks.

Cheers
John

No problem.

Cheers,
Harv

Harv.  I'll take 2 also.

Keith

G'day Harv,

I'd like to order 2 please.

Cheers

Dave

 
2 for me please

Thanks

Tim

Harv.  Please increase my order to a total of 4 now.

Thanks

Keith

Hi Harv
SA club members combined are after 8 gaskets.
I'll PM you
Dan

Hi Harv
I'll take 2 as well - thanks for organising it all.
Regards
Frank

Thanks Harv ,2 for me .cheers Steve

Hi Harv
Can you put me down for two head gaskets please

Regards
John

Can you add another one to my order, ow three in total. Any idea on times as yet?
Thanks, Jim

No drama.

I'm collecting "orders" until the end of the month. In the background, I've got a sample gasket ready to send to AA Gaskets (thanks Rob), just waiting on them to confirm the delivery address. I'm guessing the order will get placed mid-February. Delivery is 8 weeks, so probably gaskets in people's hands end-April.

Cheers,
Harv

I'll have one, please, Harv.  PM sent.

Hi Harv,

Can I please place an order for 2.

Many thanks for your continued work and support of the holden community. You are a gem.

Cheers

Rod

Done.

When you guys get a chance, can you please PM me your ames and addresses:
Old_Mt_Isa_Boy
fcwrangler
Maco
Graham_Fuller
Zulu
FCRB26
DCE80
KFH
Airfireman
Rod

That way if you dont pay for your order, I'll park my leaky FB on your driveway  :D.

Cheers,
Harv

Done

Done

Done, thanks Harv.

Done

Done

You can put me down for 2 thanks Harv.
I'll PM details tonight.

Regards,

Martyn

PM sent Harv

Put me down for 1 thanks Harv.   PM ing now    Dave

A reminder guys that today is the cut-off date for orders.

Cheers,
Harv

Hi Harv .. please put me down for 1 modified head gasket ..will PM my details ''
Regards
Stephen

Hi Harv. Have PM you details for one (1)  head gasket. Thanks Rip

Ladies and gents,

The final orders are in, and we are close to 120 gaskets total. From the FE/FC forum:

Crumpsnr - 2
Fraze - 1
DJ - 2
Old_Mt_Isa_Boy - 2
Fcwrangler - 3
Maco - 5
Graham_Fuller  (need a name and address please) - 2
Gary C - 2
FE_STD_WAGON - 3
Ardiesse - 11
Zulu  (need a name and address please) - 2
FCRB26 - 2
Trevor_B - 6
dwjweb63 - 2
Ray @ Laidley - 2
DCE80 - 9
KFH - 4
Airfireman  (need a name and address please) - 2
oldgrey58 - 2
fcee - 2
johnrap - 2
59wagon - 1
Rod - 2
JohnBM  (need a name and address please) - 2
snuff69 - 1
stephen - 1
RIP – 1

The sample gasket is now on it’s way to AA Gaskets. I have also forwarded to them the various info from the Service Bulletin, advertisement and MasterParts manual. They should be able to finalise the quote shortly, and we can get underway. I’ve also worked through the best method of posting the gaskets (with thanks to some of the forum members for chasing stuff for me). Looks like the best bet will be to package them up in some plastic wrap (to keep any dirt out), then two sheets of 7mm ply (to stop them being bent), secured with packing tape. Should cost $3 per package. Postage is likely to be $25.

Cheers,
Harv

Thanks again for your efforts Harv.
👍

Very good thanks Harv.

Great work Harv, much appreciated. Martyn

Ladies and gents,

For the gasket project to fly, we need more than 50 orders (minimum run from AA Gaskets). The 50 people get to share the tooling cost (somewhere between $800 and $1500) plus the cost per gasket ($40). With 50 participants, the cost would be $70 per gasket, excluding postage.

We currently have 118 orders. This means participants would pay $53 per gasket. Packaging (7mm ply) will cost about $3, and postage probably $25 (based on what it cost me to send a gasket from Gladstone to AA Gaskets in Melbourne). So at the moment my best guess is that it will be $80 per gasket, including postage. This will change a bit as AA Gaskets finalises their quote, and if order numbers change (see below).

There is a bit of a hurdle though. I queried AA Gaskets about the warranty that would apply. Their response is below:

“In regards warranty terms, we are treating the gasket as a non-automotive product as it will not or ever will be part of our Permaseal gasket range.
The gasket is a item that you have contracted us to produce under your design requirements.
We will supply you several off tool samples for your inspection and will require written acceptance of the gasket prior to production.
Therefore we (AA Gaskets) will not be supplying any product warranty with the gaskets”

I can understand their position. AA Gaskets will take the standard Permaseal head gasket for a grey motor, and modify it to look like our sample (an old GMH gasket I sent them). They have no idea if GMH’s engineering was good.

So here is the clincher. If you order one of these gaskets, there is no warranty at all – non from AA Gaskets, and none from me. You take your own risk that the gasket does not fail and/or lead to other damage. There are some things that make me (personally) more confident in the process:
a)   we are using a known GMH solution that was successful enough to still be in the MasterParts manual when the HR Holden was released,
b)   we have tested the effects of changing cylinder head flow using Teflon blanks (see the FE/FC forum thread), and
c)   we are using a high-quality gasket manufacturer (Permaseal).
However, there will be some people who are wary of not having a warranty, and will not want to proceed. I can understand this – no harm, no foul. I will ask each of you to please confirm (either on the forum or by PM) that you understand that there is no warranty, and wish to proceed with your order. If you do not want to proceed, please also let me know.

Cheers,
Harv

Harv,
Happy to proceed with my order please.
I understand there will be no warranty.
Thanks for the clear detail & the option.
Dave.

No problems from me either, as you say these are a quality gasket, so I would doubt there would be any problems.
Jim

Hi Harv ,yes I wish to continue with my order ,but I would have thought the gasket people may have been able to stand behind the workmanship ,in the gasket construction .cheers Steve . :)

Sounds like it's the design not the manufacture that they are unwilling to warrant. Fair enough.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Nothing ventured, nothing gained.

I'm still in for 2, and acknowledging that there is no warranty attached.

Ta, CrumpSnr

G'day Harv,
I'm happy to proceed with my order.
Thanks for your effort in getting this going!
Cheers
Dave

I'd like 2 please Harv if its not to late.

Cheers
Mark

Sent from my ZTE T84 using Tapatalk

Hi Harv
Happy to proceed with the order of 9 for the SA club.
Daniel
DCE80

Hi Harv, happy to proceed with my order for one gasket. Appreciate your efforts with this. Rip

Hi Harv,
I am happy to proceed with my order, thank you.
I understand there will be no warranty.
Cheers
Maco (John)

Harv,

I completely understand that Permaseal would be unwilling to warrant a custom product.  But hey, I know that the underlying engineering is sound.
I'll still take my ten, plus the extra for the 48&FJ club.

Rob

Hi Harv,
Understand the no warranty. Please proceed with my one and the 5 for the VIC Club.
Trevor_B

Hi Harv
Please proceed with my order for two head gaskets

Thank you
John R

I'll take 2 also.
Thanks.

Pinky.

Hi Harv,

Please proceed with my order.

Cheers

Rod

Hi Harv.  I am still good to go with my order.

Keith

Im in

Ladies and Gents,

Another update. I have received the finalised quote from AA Gaskets. Tooling will be $1400+GST, though the gasket tooling will remain my property while at AA Gaskets and AA Gaskets will maintain the tool for its producing life (5000 pcs). The gasket will be non-asbestos head gasket material 1.4mm thick (+/- 5%), silicone coated. Gasket price (without recovering the tooling cost) is $40.00+GST. Minimum order quantity is 50 units (we are well over that). Once I pay the deposit, we should receive a sample in 4 weeks. Once we approve the sample, the production time is 4-5 weeks.

There are still a few people (about 20 gaskets worth) who haven’t confirmed that they are happy to proceed without warranty, or have not given me an address. I need an answer from them before the end of the month, after which I will assume all orders are final.
Fraze: Need you to confirm that you are still OK to proceed without a warranty   (1 gasket).
Graham_Fuller: Need your address (2 gaskets).
FE_STD_WAGON: Need you to confirm that you are still OK to proceed without a warranty (3 gaskets).
Zulu: Need you to confirm that you are still OK to proceed without a warranty, and need your address (2 gaskets).
FCRB26: Need you to confirm that you are still OK to proceed without a warranty   (2 gaskets).
Ray @ Laidley: Need you to confirm that you are still OK to proceed without a warranty   (2 gaskets).
oldgrey58: Need you to confirm that you are still OK to proceed without a warranty (2 gaskets).
JohnBM: Need you to confirm that you are still OK to proceed without a warranty, and need your address (2 gaskets).
57effie   Need your address (2 gaskets).
black57   Need your address (2 gaskets).
Ken's57   Need your address (2 gaskets).

Assuming that all 20 missing orders go ahead, we have 126 gaskets. Pricing will be as follows:
Your share of the tooling cost: $13
Each gasket: $46
Packaging: $3 (you only pay this once per order)
Postage: $25 (you only pay this once per order)
Total: $87.00 for the 1st gasket, $59 for each gasket thereafter.
These are almost the final numbers: I’ll finalise them at the end of the month.

Cheers,
Harv

Harv
I will confirm more order for 2 and raise it by 1
Sounds like a game of cards
So thats 3 in total
Will pm you my address
Cheers Gary

Good work mate, buy you a beer when over that way.

Hi Harv,

Yes I would like to still proceed without the warranty for my 3 gasket

Regards Mick

Harv, yes I still want my one gasket without warranty so this is confirmation, thanks, Fraze

Confirmed Harv. PM sent re my address.
Cheers, Ken

Hi Harv.  PM sent.  Mike.

Hi Harv,
Thanks and I'm fine with the no warranty. I'll also add another to my order if I may, so a total of 3 please.
Cheers

Ladies and Gents,

Another update. I have paid for the tooling, and now need to give AA Gaskets the final order quantity. This will be 138 gaskets (lookit that… strange coincidence).

Final costing:
Your share of the tooling cost: $11
Each gasket: $44
Packaging: $3 (you only pay this once per order)
Postage: $25 (you only pay this once per order)
Total: $83 for the 1st gasket, $55 for each gasket thereafter.
i.e. if you ordered one gasket, you owe me $83. If you ordered two gaskets, you owe me $138. If you ordered three gaskets, you owe me $193. If you ordered four gaskets, you owe me $248.
I know Blacky and some of the other guys want to combine postage, or pick up from my place at Sydney. Happy to do so, just let know when I PM you.

Next steps:
a)   I will give the final gasket order quantity (138) to AA Gaskets.
b)   AA Gaskets will invoice me for 50% of the gaskets (about $3,000), which I will pay.
c)   I will send a PM to each of the gasket buyers, giving my account details and the value of the money that they owe me. When you transfer the cash to me, make sure you include your forum user name.
d)   AA Gaskets will make some trial samples, and send them to me to check.
e)   I will pay the final balance to AA Gaskets, and they will send me the 138 gaskets. Hopefully by then all you guys will have paid for your gaskets. For the non-payers, bear in mind that I have your name and address... I will have no hesitation parking my leaky FB on your stencilcrete driveway when I come to discuss payment .
f)   I will pack up and ship the gaskets to the buyers.

Cheers,
Harv

just to let you know that we appreciate all your legwork and taking this project "by the horns"and following through,with your own funding etc.im sure the sentiments of all purchasers would be the same.looking forward to the end product.Great stuff ...phil.

Ladies and Gents,

A quick update on the gasket process. AA Gaskets has received the money for the tooling, and is in the process of having the tooling made. The tooling should be complete by mid-April (at their last estimate), after which AA Gaskets will send me some sample gaskets to approve. They will then make the gaskets, and send to me. I will then divvy them up per everyone’s orders, and mail them out. I’ve bought the plywood that we need for the packing, ready to go.

On the order side, everyone who has placed an order should now have received a PM from me requesting payment. If you placed an order, please check your PMs – let me know if I missed anyone. The payments are starting to trickle in, so all looking good so far.

Cheers,
Harv

Thats great Harve. i sent my $83.00 via paypal this morning, cheers, Fraze

Harv .deposited cash to your acc t his morning ,sent a  pm ,let me know if ok .cheers Steve . ;)

Ladies and gents,

A quick update. The tooling is progressing, with AA Gaskets expecting tooling samples early next week. Around 80% of people have paid for their gaskets. Still need payment from crumpsnr, fcwrangler, Graham_Fuller, Trevor_B, Ray @ Laidley, 57effie and black57 please.

Cheers,
Harv

Hi Harv, the boss showed me tonight how to fund the paypal account. Soon as funds hit I'll do the transfer. Apologies for the delay.

Regards,

Martyn

Hi Harv payment done.
Cheers,
Graham

Hi Harv, payment done.
Regards,
Jim

Payment sent Harv.

Many thanks,

Martyn (CrumpSnr)

Ladies and gents,

A quick update. AA Gaskets has completed the tooling, and sent me a tooling sample on Monday. The image below shows a NOS GMH “better cooling” gasket, and a new AA Gaskets “better cooling” gasket:
(http://i929.photobucket.com/albums/ad136/V8EKwagon/IMG_0349_zpsnuuepvhw.jpg) ($2)

(Rob: they have taken good care of your gasket, need to return it to you at some stage – very much appreciated).

For comparison, the photo below shows a new AA Gaskets “better cooling” gasket and a AA Gaskets standard grey motor gasket:
(http://i929.photobucket.com/albums/ad136/V8EKwagon/IMG_0350_zpsuokywxji.jpg) ($2)

To help reconcile which holes are which, shown below is a bare cylinder head:
(http://i929.photobucket.com/albums/ad136/V8EKwagon/IMG_0348_zpspajc2tsr.jpg) ($2)

I did some comparisons (old, new and new “better cooling”), and the new gasket looks great. Have signed off on the sample, and will now pay AA to commence our run.

Cheers,
Harv

Awesome stuff harv they looked fantastic..

Harv,

Interesting - it looks like AA Gaskets has made completely new tooling for the repro 7424869.  Comparing the holes on the standard head gasket, and their counterparts on the 7424869, the holes on the 7424869 are different, and smaller.

So they've made as close as possible to an exact copy of the 7424869, rather than removing twelve punch-and-die sets from the standard grey head gasket tooling.

I am impressed.

One question though - what's the maximum bore diameter usable on the sample 7424869?  3-3/16"?  3-1/4"?

Rob

I was impressed with the quality too.

I didn't record the bore size, but did run the caliper over both the NOS "better cooling" one, the new AA Gasket "better cooling" one and a new standard AA gasket - all had the same bore shape/dimensions.

It's been more than a few years since I've replaced a head gasket, which leads me into the next question.
Will the gasket be marked front and back or top and bottom?
The reason I ask is that the last time I did a grey head gasket, it was interchangeable.
The raised bead around the cylinder bore holes on the gasket are joined between the cylinders as shown in the new gasket and was face up when installed from memory, This was to prevent a blown gasket between combustion chambers/cylinders.
Can anyone confirm this?
The two gaskets that are shown for comparison, only shows the one side with the single raised bead around each cylinder bore hole.
The gasket imprint on the cylinder head shown shows the raised bead join between the combustion chamber, indicating the way the new gasket is shown in the photo is the correct way up when installed.

Regards Seb

Can someone copy and paste my above post re: gasket, on the FB-EK Forum please?
The site is not responding.

Regards Seb

Your right Seb, the grey head gaskets can be put on one way, or upside down. For the new gaskets, this will make a big difference, as the water holes are no longer mirror imaged. Put it on the wrong way, and the water flow will be affected.

I will include a note in the paperwork (perhaps a little sketch) showing which way goes to the front.

Cheers,
Harv

Ladies and Gents,

A quick update. The run of gaskets have nearly been completed, with an anticipated delivery to me late next week (~23rd of June). Plan to get them out to you all in the fortnight following.

Cheers,
Harv

Hi Harv,

Thanks for the update, look forward to receiving them.
Cheers
John

Thanks for the update Harv. Looking forward to seeing them.

Keith

Great

Ladies and Gents,

I have received the new grey motor improved cooling head gaskets from AA Gaskets, which look really good. They have been individually packaged (similar to how you would buy a normal head gasket from Repco), which will make them easy to store. I have printed out both the excerpt from the Accelerator article (which gives a how-to on installation), and a warning note. The warning note indicates the following:

WARNING
The standard grey motor head gasket is able to be turned upside down. The holes in the standard gasket are mirrored – one end has the same holes as the other end. Turning the standard gasket upside down does not affect coolant flow.
This new gasket is not mirrored – the holes are different in each end. The end closest to the rear of the engine has more holes, to direct coolant to the rear of the engine. The end closest to the front of the engine has less holes to prevent cylinder 1 stealing all the coolant. This new gasket can only be put onto the engine one way.
If you accidently put the new gasket on upside down, almost all the coolant will flow to cylinders 1 and 2. Cylinders 5 and 6 will starve for coolant, and will overheat. You may damage your engine.
Check the diagram below, and make sure that you have the gasket up the right way before installation

I have included a photo of the new gasket, with the orientation marked.

I’m back on the road for work again, and have brought half the gaskets (plus the plywood to ship them in) with me. I’ll start posting them out this week – please be patient as this will take a while. Once they are in the post, I’ll send each of you a PM with the tracking number.

Cheers,
Harv

Thanks Harv.

Hi Harv,

You are a champion for all the effort you have put into this to make it happen, it is very much appreciated.
Cheers
John

Thanks Harv your a champion. Cheers Graham

Mine arrived today, they look fantastic. Just need to get the engine rebuilt and back together.
Thanks again for all the work and effort you put in to make these happen.
Regards, Jim

Hi Harv,

My gaskets arrived today, they look fantastic, much appreciate the effort you have put into this project.
Cheers
John

Hi Harv

My gaskets arrived today and they look fantastic.  Thanks again for all the effort you have put into the project to make it happen.

Keith

No drama gents.

The second round went into the post yesterday, and I will send a PM with tracking number to the recipients this morning. That's half the orders done.

For the next (and final) batch, I need to get home again (I've run out of gaskets here at work). Should get them into the post mid next week.

Cheers,
Harv

Harv
My headgaskets arrived today, very well packaged

Thanks for all your effort mate

Ladies and Gents,

All gaskets have now been sent - everyone should have received a PM giving their tracking number. Please check your inboxes.

Rob - yours are safely at my place, ready for pickup (once I eventually get home again).

Ray @ Laidley, Black57 - I don't think I have received payment for your gaskets. Could be an error on my part though. If you have paid, let me know roughly how/when and I will track back through my PayPal or bank records.

59wagon - please check your PMs.

Cheers,
Harv

Hi Harv,
Not sure if anyone has reported back after fitting one of the new head gaskets....

I finally got a chance to fit one to my L Block in my FC Sedan - a notorious overheater  :(

It regularly ran at 90 - 100 degreesC (using temp gauge at back coolant port on head).

Fitted the gasket with modifications as described and now have a temp gauge that runs at 75-80 degrees (in 25 degree ambient conditions) so definitely a noticeable decrease in temp at the rear cylinders.

Thanks again for your efforts in securing these for these greater Grey Motor community.

Trevor_B
PS. have you been able to do that count?

are you doing anymore harv

Not at this stage. I bought nearly 200, and had some spares. Over the last year, the spares have been dwindling. The last lot of spares went down to the Vic club last month. All I have left now are the ones for my own use.

To get another order going, we would need at least 50 orders. If someone wants to collect orders and manage the cash side, I'm more than happy for them to use my dies at AA Gaskets to do another run. I'd do the organising myself, but for now I need to finish a few other jobs. Got my daughters EK ute registered yesterday, and need to get my EK wagon project done (... its been more than 10 years as a project  :-[).

Cheers,
Harv

hey harv, did anyone do anymore of these? thanks

Yep, I just finished doing another round of these. They were mailed out to people just before Christmas. There were a few left over from the order, but as suspected a heap of people are still asking for them. I will try to reconcile what I have left against the requests some time today. If there are any left overs, I'll let you guys know.

Cheers,
Harv

Hi harv do you have any more headgaskets for sale

G’day Hurls,

My personal stash is getting very, very low - have helped a few guys out over the last two years and now running short. I can probably do one for you, but that is likely the last one (I made hundreds of these... they disappear faster than Covid toilet paper). PM me your name and address and I’ll send you through some payment details. Might take a few weeks as I am out of plywood packing and will shortly be on the road for work.

I can always get another batch made (I own the dies), but it takes a minimum of 50 for a production run.

Cheers,
Harv

Sign me up for a couple if there is a new run going

Jemahl

Hi Harv,
There is still interest from the VIC Club if you are considering another run, just let me know costs and I will check for those prepared to put down a deposit. My guess we would be looking at 10-15??

Cheers,
Trevor_B

Hi Harv,   You can put me down for 4 (four).  Will confirm order with pm.   AL.

i would be interested in 3   Thanks Aussie