FE-FC Holden Discussion Forum

(http://s29.postimg.org/z28yx0r43/030_1024x683.jpg) ($2)

At the All Holden Day in Adelaide recently an elderly gentleman asked me a question about the hub cap pressing process.

He was a metallurgist for BHP and spent quite a lot of time at various Holden plants.

His question was how many pressings does it take to make a Hubcap? (stainless and steel were the same number)

Cheers Stewy   8)

I've seen some archival footage of the presses at GMH on larger panels like the roof panel, and it is amazing how much deformation can be achieved in just one pressing.
I can imagine the entire profile being pressed in just one go with a follow up process to roll over the edge where it clips onto the rim.

Ken

Would like to say yes, but the big press was probably in use pushing out panels at a great rate.
He observed that it was a very labour intensive process that involved only a bit at a time.

Cheers Stewy   8)

Makes you wonder why they persisted with the same general shape right upto HK. I can see the HK hub cap being easier to press and the FB was an easier one i guess, but then they went back to pressing out the same shape again in EK.

Ken

He said they persisted with this method until the 70s and the number of pressings were still similar. Wonder where all the dies went?

Cheers Stewy   8)

So, what's the answer, how many?
Regards
Alex

Any Guesses?

Cheers Stewy   8)

OK, since you've said it's very labour intensive ill guess its more like 20 pressings ::)

Ken

Each one? I really thought the presses & conveyers would have had it refined to a lot less steps for mass production.
I wonder what the steps were & where it commenced.

I was quite shocked, but it was only 14 individual pressings.
He said that each stage was only small to stretch the steel slightly because the risk of splitting was quite high.
The hardest one was the last one which rolled over the retaining lip.
Wonder how many they did? as they passed them down the line.
When you consider 155,161 FEs, 191,724 FCs times by 4 = 1,387,540. hubcaps without spares.
I can't vouch for the first hand knowledge, but he did seem quite genuine.

Cheers Stewy   8)

That's amazing. They must have cost heaps. Not far off what Ken suggested but a long way off what I expected (4-5 at the most).

can they do em now for a 15 inch wheel? 8)

On the subject of hubcaps I have an interesting one at home. The lion is upside down, I have attached a couple of pictures here of a normal one and a quick photoshop of what the wrong one looks like, I'll take a picture of the one I have at home and put it up. Has anyone seen one of these upside-down hubcaps before? I'd be curious to find out just how many of these "Friday" hubcaps are floating around.
(http://s23.postimg.org/a8doyp8gn/FE_Hubcap_001.jpg) ($2)

(http://s1.postimg.org/h0nmmbekr/FC_Hubcap_QA_Fail.jpg) ($2)

Misalignment by factory worked after a long lunch?

I would love to see the photo of it.
The lion was the first pressing so you cant blame that person.
probably the triangle was the next so you think someone down the line would have seen it!
Not very good quality control or maybe they let it run to see how far it would get.
And it got all the way through  :)

Cheers Stewy   8)

There are a few of the upside down caps around, there are also these which are not uncommon as well
(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/02/04/uve7e8eh.jpg)
(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/02/04/yhupe7yn.jpg)
They have a dot under the lion for some reason which is pressed in.
These 2 are on my trailer, but are not in real good nick as they have a bit of surface rust

Ken


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk ($2)

Well, you learn something each day

I'll have to check through my collection

That upside down one is unusual

Gary

Well I never.....
Thanks for the info.
Regards
Alex

Maybe they were a wankel rotary lover and just didnt know it back then. ;D

Here we go, I took this picture last night of the odd hubcap. As you can see it has been well used so it must have slipped through a few sets of eyes over the years.  ???
(http://s16.postimg.org/o5ajwrp5t/FC_Hubcap_QA_Fail_orig.jpg) ($2)

I didn't realise the parallels between hubcaps and coin collecting.  In numismatic circles they call this an "upset", where the dies for the obverse and reverse side of the coin are misaligned.  If you get, say a 20c piece and hold it with thumb and forefinger at 12 and 6, and QE2's image upright, and then spin the coin around to the "tails" side, the design should be upright.  Apparently there were a fair few pennies minted with heads and tails upside-down with respect to each other - the "6-o'clock upset".  And there were lots of kangaroo pennies with a full stop after the word "PENNY".  And in 1951 quite a lot of Australian coinage was minted in London, and the coins had "PL" on their reverse for identification.

Bet you didn't want to know that . . .

Rob

Probably a dyslectic worker at the factory

Stainless Hubcaps were mentioned earlier in the thread.

I only have 1 out of my collection of 20 odd , and that's one I picked up last month at the Junortoun swap.

Are they fairly rare or have I just not been looking in the right places?

I picked up some new SS hubcaps last year, still in original GMH plastic bags. The person I bought them from believed they were produced for FE, but not for FC. I can't confirm this but if your search criteria doesn't already span both FE & FC, maybe it limits the results found.

I wonder if this ever resulted in the lion facing the other way.

The hubcap pressing was changed to steel in 1958. So most FE's have stainless hubcaps.
It's simple to tell the difference, they are much lighter and dent easily.
All FX and FJ had stainless hubcaps and FC onwards are steel until they were changed to plastic with the Commodore.
There are some hubcaps with more distinctive lion pressings than others which is due to die wear.
Ken

Ken,
Was that late in the FE production or early in the FC production?
Dave.

Ken,

I have a chromed steel FJ hubcap at home, and I'm almost certain my father's HR wagon had stainless hubcaps.  They didn't rust (they and the rear side window moulds were the only part of the car which didn't), and they were quite light.

Rob

While looking through the HOLDEN "FE" Illustrated Parts Catalogue # 68-HI-56

Section 5.858

This has 2 different part numbers for  CAP, COVER - Wheel hub

                CAP - Chrome plated ...............      ALL ............   7410004       quantity 4    N.P.    (New Part)

                CAP - Stainless steel ..............       ALL ............   7410450       quantity 4    N.P.


So this will make it impossible to date the chrome plated ones as later as they were being made in 1956


Cheers Stewy   8)

That's very interesting Stewy, I don't have that parts book but I have the later FE one 77-H-57.
This lists FE hubcap as 7410450. They list part number 7410004 in the back as superseded by 7410450.
The next book I have is the EJ book. Now the FE and FC cap is listed as 7410004 and now 7410450 is in the back of the book as being replaced by 7410004. :o
Maybe some early 56 models had steel caps. Anybody have an original early FE with steel caps that they are pretty sure are original to the car?

Ken