FE-FC Holden Discussion Forum

G'day
Was looking at this outrigger on ebay and was wondering if this is a replacement for an EH outrigger for the HR front end . I know it says for V8 chev but was thinking it might be right for the change over . Has anyone used one of these for a HR front end swap over ?

Cheers Fred

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=281174565512&fromMakeTrack=true&ssPageName=VIP:watchlink:top:en

Okay had an outcome . Spoke to Waddingtons today and they have assured me that this outrigger is a replacement for the EH outrigger and will fit into an FC when adapted to a HR front end ..

What! No one has any input into this ? Would be interested to know if anyone else would consider using this outrigger instead of having to chase up a Eh or earlier outrigger for this swap over !

OK the only reason why I wouldn't use one is the price. I could get an FB to EJ one for less than $20 if I needed one.  I guess if you had no access to any early wrecks they would be worth considering.

Ken

Thanks Ken . Would be more then happy to use an original one if anyone has one to part with.

I started to reply to this yesterday but got distracted .When I was doing these conversions we had to use what ever the customer provided . At a quick look , the step up at the front would suggest that it sits lower on the crossmember or is not as deep at the back . It could be to allow room for a front mounted rack . Normally I would take a pie cut from each sid of the outrigger and pull the back down lower to give around 60mm width where it welds to the crossmember so the rack would sit over the top . We had an old subframe as a jig when welding these on but under and out will also work . Whatever outrigger you use it is important to get it in the right position and the right angle onto the crossmember . Cheers

Hi Froger;
When I did my HR x-member conversion I removed the FC outrigger from the old x-member and welded it to the HR x-member it fits up perfect with the mount under the radiator!!
Regards
Neil H

Thanks for the feedback Fellas.

It's interesting you say that Neil. I did the same but I find there are many on the forum who say it doesn't work (or maybe doesn't work as well as others, don't quote me!) and that EH is the go. I'll find out soon enough once i get to that stage on mine.  Martyn

Heres the deal.
There were issues with FE & FC front crossmembers. They would bend and crack and would get wear in the wishbone spindles.
The replacement part for an FE or FC in later years was an FB EK front end because they superceded the older front end.
So there were plenty of FE & FC's with later cross members in them.
A stock standard FE FC front crossmember cannot have the outrigger cut off and welded to a HR front crossmember without modification.

Ken

Thanks Ken. So if I understand correctly does that mean there's a chance Neil and I might have unknowingly had later front ends, which had an outrigger that worked with HR? How good is the internet. There was no way of getting this sort of help years ago! Regards, Martyn

Hey Fred,if your in Melb,bring it around and i'll weld it up 4 you.Gaz!
Just PM me,ok! ;D

Thanks Ken ,you made it clear for everyone . The fe crossmember was extremely shallow through the dip in the middle the fc also had this dip . This makes the outrigger to crossmember the wrong angle and also the front mounting block . Its not a difficult mod. for anyone with an angle grinder and a mig. Cheers

Your on Gaz be there on the weekend , road trip ;D

Hi Ken
Thanks for the information I have always wondered why people were saying they had difficulty when I had done mine and it seemed straight forward.
When I was looking at the tech info page and I punched in what I thought was the original engine number it told me it was a later engine so this fits with what you are saying and I assume now that when somebody changed the engine they also changed the x-member.
I have just picked up a FC ute that needs a lot of TLC, can you tell me the real diffrences so I know if this has also been changed, apparenly there is no chassis number and I dont have the engine number yet so possibility is that it also has been changed at some stage.
I will get the ID plate numbers for you when I remember how to post pictures ::)
Regards
Neil H

It's difficult to tell just by looking at it with the engine in. What you should be able to see is that the FE FC crossmember is curved across the centre under the sump, whilst the FB EK one is flatter across the centre. The outriggers look the same until you hold them up side to side.

Ken

Don't want to rock the boat here ,but why couldn't we have a sticky in the Tech section or Mod section on HR front end installment , out riggers .variant brake set ups ,pictures maybe ? I spent a heap of time chasing up old threads for information on the subject as I'm think'n a lot of other members have on this subject as it's pretty much a standard mod over the years ..Maybe I missed a Sticky on the subject .
 I've seen the post Ken has provided from the past which could be the head post in the thread.
 If it's not been done already what do use reckon ?

Gotta be honest mate I don't know why you want a sticky on outriggers specifically in hr cross members. A lot of members are now using tubular setups to be able to use power steer, unmodified sumps and larger rotors. Eg pat gardners front cross member.
Out of my build that was the least considered mod I had (for a 5L injected 304). I butchered an Ej cross member and installed a HR front which is Four bolts and held the outrigger in place to weld.
Using a good caliper and rotor setup then may be worth a sticky but there are so many different combinations for different budgets or because of wheel choice it would be difficult to create a good sticky.
Might pay to go through some ones build pages and if you like it the roll with it. Crap pun intended.
My two cents...

Here's the tech story for the HR front end
http://www.fefcholden.org.au/techinfo/tech002.html

NES304 is correct . If I was new to this forum and everybody was doing the same conversions or was std original I would turn it off .I spend time on this forum to help people and am always impressed with the variety of ideas . Here is an example ,prior to the mid 80's in QLD it was illegal to install red motors in FX to EH . I still have a 138cu red motor with a starfire 4 speed and LC LJ tailshaft . It sat over a EH frontend and used a HG clutch fork and a FC fluid slave cylinder with the help of a adaptor plate to piviot the in reverse . Does that need a sticky? Sorry for being sarcastic. Regards Haydn

If you look at the question I asked a little closer it wasn't specifically asking for outrigger installment NES304. What you stated about people using other set ups and the like was more on where I was aiming a sticky or maybe a dedicated thread to say modified front end installment brake set or different gearbox set ups , engine set ups or whatever else you can think of , not a hard ask .. And what you blurted on about Hayden in regards to that eh front end if that was a done thing by you or anyone else why not have a dedicated spot for that kind of talk instead having to spend hours trawling through build threads or using a search option with 56 threads containing the letters HR and the like . As for me personally I don't just have one old car I have 4 like many would I suppose , all being  different breeds to each other and life being the way it is today I really don't have time to be spending hours going through every build thread on different forums looking for a specific mod . Don't get me wrong I enjoy looking at peoples build threads good for motivation and creative thinking when time permits.
Looking for specific info sometimes is like a hard drive that hasn't been fragmented , there's bits of info all over the place ..
Anyway no harm in throwing a few ideas out there now and then .. I'll shut up now  ;D

Sorry mate ,that's not what I was getting at .Many of the people on this forum have spent decades restoring hundreds if not like in my case thousands of old holdens and can offer you any help or advise you could possibly need . But I still find new ideas and am constantly amazed by the skills and the diversity of people frequenting this forum . If you wish to mod your old holden then first talk to your local government department authority and decide what you want to do, then talk to someone on this forum who has done it . HR  ,L300 ,torana front end is the least of the mods. change outrigger and move engine mounts ,red ,blue ,black ,v6 ,v8 red or small block ,rearend HR ,9",commodore,volvo,Hilux, full chassis ,its all been done ,and the people that did it are all here . I am constantly finding new ideas on this forum and if we start making lists to tell people how they should do these cars we will lose a lot of great new or old forgotten ideas . If you need any help or information just contact me .Cheers