FE-FC Holden Discussion Forum

 :) Hi folk's,
                 just about to start the 186 on the engine stand for the wifes fe, and cant find information on spark plug gaps, and points gaps for the 186, can anyone help ???
Cheers Spider

Have this at home.  Check back tomorrow.

RET

Spider,

RET will come back with the Holden stuff but here's something to keep you amused in the meantime

Check this out http://www.bosch.com.au/productcatalogue/sat/products/files/sparkplugs_passenger.pdf

Full details of Bosch plugs for all models sold in Australia including first appearance of the 186 in the HR.  186 Gap is about 30 thou.

May be worth downloading and keeping handy ::) or maybe not  :P

We used to set all plug gaps slightly wider because as the plug ages normal coatings will reduce the gap. You can get away with about 5 thou extra if your coil and leads are in good nick.

Cheers,

Craig. ;D

 ;)Thanks Fellas,
                         I down loaded that page but my acrobat 3 couldnt recognise some of it so all i got was black boxes. Thanks ret i will check back tommorrow, and also thanks craig with the tripple linkages information. I think i will end up making my own, if i cant find a set.
Cheers Spider ;D 8)

Spider,

I checked in the manual (rather than my VB affected brain) and the spec is between 32-38 Thou. Still reckon new plugs should be set to the higher end, or just above at 40 Thou.

You should get yourself the latest version of Acrobat Reader from here http://www.adobe.com/products/acrobat/readstep.html it's FREE and you'll be able to see the latest content.

Cheers,

Craig.

Thanks Craig, Downloading as we speak. I went and set the plugs gave it a crank (the motor that is :D) and all she kept doing is backfiring thru the carby. I brought up number 1 piston, took out the dizzy turned the cam lobe past number1 to just before number 5 opens and dropped in the dizzy. I then put a test light on it and adjusted the timing by hand but it is still popping thru the carby?. ANY Ideas?
Cheers Spider

Spider,

There are a few ways to locate the dissy but here's the one I use.

Remove all plugs

Turn engine over by hand until No1 piston is reaching TDC on the compression stroke.

You can tell this by having someone else turn the fan while you place your finger in the spark plug hole - you'll feel the air pressure against your finger. The pressure indicates that both valves are closed, proving your on the compression stroke. You can also use a torch and look into the oil filler cap hole to see that both valves at stationary

Now just turn the fan slowly until the timing mark on the harmonic balancer lines up with the TDC mark on the engine.

You can stop it at the 6 Degree mark if you like; this will set the static timing as per spec.

Now place the dissy into the engine so the rotors leading edge just reaches the No1 plug lead position.

Tighten it up, replace the plugs and HT leads and you should be OK.

Make sure you check the plug leads are installed in the correct order - 153624 - it sounds simple but I bet most of us have been caught at some stage :-[

Cheers,

Craig.

Hey Craig,
               I had the tappet cover off when i was bringing up number1 piston, and lined up the notch on the harmonic balancer to top dead centre mark. I went past the number1 lead to just before the number5 lead so when i put the distributor back in it would allow for the rotor to back to just past no1 lead. Is this what you mean when you say the leading edge just reaches number 1 lead.
Cheers Spider

Spider,

Did you check you were at TDC on compression?

Induction (Inlet Valve open, Piston on downstroke)
Compression (Valves Closed, Piston on upstroke)
Firing or Power(Valves Closed, Piston on downstroke)
Exhaust (Exhaust Valve Open, Piston on upstroke)

(http://murray.newcastle.edu.au/users/students/2002/c9806336/4stroke.jpg)

Plug needs to fire 6 Degrees rotational movement after the piston reaches top dead centre of the compression stroke. The engines intertia carries the piston past TDC then it gets "pushed" again by the exploding fuel/air mixture.

Hope this helps.

Cheers,

Craig

Hi Spider,
              The points gap on a 186 is anywhere between 19thou and 26 thou.Ive always set mine at 22 thou and been fine.Backfiring through the carb usually means u are 180 degrees out...Hope this helps...BRAD

OK, here we go:

(From HR specs, presume basic 186 and not X2 or S motor)

Engine: 3 5/8" bore.
Oil Capacity: 6 pints w/o filter, 7.5 pints with filter
AC Spark Plug Type: C44NS (optionally use C43N for severe service)
Gap: .033 - .038
Contact Point Set (Bosch or Lucas): Gap .012 - .016 in
Oil Filter Type: AC PF10 Element.

The HK Spec sheet is much the same, except it recommends:
Contact Point Set (Bosch): Gap .019 - .025 in
Contact Point Set (Lucas): Gap .017 - .024 in

The Torana, on the other hand, lists the same spark plug (C44NS), but with a gap of .036 - .040 for the base 186.

And then the HT and HG reckon exactly .038 spark plug gap.

So 186s ain't 186s, apparently.  (Nor are they 186Ss, for that matter).  If you know what your motor came out of, then you should have all the exacting info you need here.  If you don't, well just have a stab ;)

 ;D Thankyou everyone for your HELP,
                                                           Ive set the poimts and plug's, and thankyou "RET" for the spec's it has been printed and put away for reference. But she still wont fire :-[, so i have got a mate of my father who's a mechanic, is going to come around and check it out, it will be something stupid, ive adgusted the timing that many times with no luck and i checked it was on compression stroke as "Craig A" advised. I will Let all of you know when it fires and what the problem was, which will be embarrassing without doubt, and be kicking myself for not seeing it ::)
CHEERS SPIDER 8)

Howdy Folks,
                    Found the problem, the harmonic balancer had shifted. The motor had been rebuilt when i got it and the vehicle was in a accident. The harmonic balancer was the only part of the motor that was damaged on impact. It had a chip and a slight wobble, so i didnt think anything of it, but this was the cause of me not being able to get it fired it was out to buggery. So now i feel much better, i was starting to think i was going nut's. So "THANKYOU TO EVERYONE" that replied and have a excellent xmas and new year. ;D
Cheers Spider 8)

Spider,

This used to happen a fair bit on heavily worked red motors. The outer ring would spin around under full load putting the timing mark out. The backyard fix was to screw a couple of opposing (to keep the balance) self tappers into the rubber. Bastard didn't move then ;D

Cheers,

Craig.

With the red harmonic balancer, they have a vulcanised rubber "packer" between the inner and outer rings.
This always deteriorates and allows the timing marks to go whereever they want to.
Holden even realised this and added a safety cover on the XU1s so that the outer didn't fly of into the fan.

What my old man and I did to get exact TDC and get me going again was to get an old spark plug and break the guts out of it, weld a tube onto it and then add some clear plastic hose. Put some water in the hose, (so it doesn't run into the cylinder and turn the motor slowly over by hand. When the water stops moving in the hose, then you have Top Dead Centre.
NOTE: This was in a country town on a Sunday and replacement balancers weren't available.
They only cost about $18 new.

going through all my old books and points gap is16- 18thou in all books,
if motor is warm to hot spend the extra and get a new harmonic balancer.actually even stock its money well spent if realy warm cam it should have good aftermarket balancer