FE-FC Holden Discussion Forum

Is there anyway to put a 327 chev in an fc ute and legally register it in NSW?. Everything I have read seems to point to no but I was hoping maybe someone on here knew a way to do it....

Cheers

Depends on the original factory weight of the ute.

I'm putting 307 into EK sedan ( in NSW ) and based on it's original factory weight ( 1131 KG ) I can go to 332 cubes ( naturally aspirated engine ) so a 327 into my car would be permitted.

Find an engineer in NSW and talk to him.

There is a formula to find out maximum permitted engine sizes on the DOTARS site, I'll see if I can find it for you.

Just got one through a couple of months back and put a 305ci with a 350 crank and came out 310ci max size for the FC was 314ci from memory and he measured bore and stroke while the heads were off he also said that the the 4ci was meant to be there for reconditioning factor [but he was a bit of a dick]  but we did get rego ........FC427.......

On the DOTARS site ( Department of Transport and Regional Services ) there is a link to National Code of Practise for Light Vehicle Construction and Modification.

Look under NCOP3 Section LA1 Engines.

Scroll down the page to about section 2.2.

There is a formula there which you can work out maximum swept volume for engine replacement/conversion.

Maybe someone can throw up a link to it directly as I don't know how to :-[ :-[ :-[.

In the meantime,

If your ute weighs 1100 kg or more you can go to 5500 cc's ( approx 332 cubes )

Formula for this weight is 1100 x 5 = 5500   = max capacity in cc's.


If your ute is between 800 kg and 1100 kg then you can go to 4400 cc's ( approx 270 cubes )

Formula for this weight is 1100 x 4 = 4400   = max capacity in cc's.

Each state rego mobs tweak these rules to suit them selves and engineers can vary their interpretation of these rules also so there can be some difference in what you will and won't be allowed between the different states and engineer signatories within those states.

I've found an excellent engineer and I'm keeping on the good side of him ;D ;D ;D

Go to www.dotars.gov.au  and in the searchbar in top right corner type NCOP.

Then just click on the "National Code of Practise for Light Vehicle Construction and Modification" tab and it's all there.

Cheers for that fellas!!!!
I have had a good look over those pages and the nsw one as well and it seems that 327 is just to big no matter how I calculate it.
I have used a weight of 1095kg for the ute and I think if anything it is slightly lighter than this which doesnt help my cause much at all! :-\
Thanks heaps for the help.... guess the 327 powered ute will have to live on in my dreams :)

John

JSM,
The beauty about chevs are there are numerous combinations you can get by swapping parts. If they are not going to measure the volume and stroke of your motor, use an early 283 or 307 block and stroke it using other chev cranks and pistons. A lot of the 307 blocks have 307 stamped as the prefix for the engine number and the only person who would know the internals are not standard would be you. Get yourself a book called how to hotrod small block chevs and it tells you what cranks and pistons to use for different cubes.
Hope this helps
Brett

I'd still talk to an engineer as we are only talking a few kg's less than the 1100 kg mark for the allowable 332 cube maximum.

And I'm sure there would be a fair few FE/FC's getting around that don't conform exactly to the formula unless they were passed by an engineer before that formula came out a few years ago.

Won't know if you don't ask,and don't stop at the first engineer either,shop around as I did.

One of the better ones was 283 Chev block with a small journal 327 crank comes out at 302 and revs like hell .....And remember these specifications from the RTA are only guide lines so ask your Engineer what he wants you to do to fit the 327 before you abandon the dream .....FC427......

What would happen if you just did it and said nothing? If you never sold it, would it matter?

 It still has to pass engineer's inspection before it can be registered.

Cheers Fellas
Ill have a ring around and see if there is anyone who is willing to do a certificate/ tell me what they would like me to do for them to approve such modifications.
Hopefully ill have some luck!!!!

John

John,

I'll send you the details of the engineer I'm using.Try him and see how he goes with your proposal.

This is not right, you need to use a 327 small journal block and either fit the 265 or 283 crank, this gives the 4:00" bore and the 3:00" stroke, alternatively bore the 283 to 4:00". Best crank to use is the 265 unit if you can find one. A 307 is the same bore as a 283 with the longer stroke. Again an alternative is to bore a 307 to 4:00" to get more cubes  (327)

In regard to the engineer, FC427 has good advice, talk to the engineer, make him your best mate and do what he tells you to do.

I didnt go for the V8 in my car but I did go to a public weihbridge and got an official weight that was used by my engineer to work out the actual weight, which was then used in the calculation as to maximum capacity I could fir.  I had half a tank of fuel in mine, so that added a few kg's I guess.

Not sure if this works for you in NSW.

MikeM That odd it usually goes on the manufactures specifications for the weight ......FC427.......

You could get a donor block and restamp the 327? Bit naughty but possible.
                    Cheers, Glenn.

what Glenn said.  :D :D

Only trouble with that guys is the block casting number that relates to the size of the engine and year of manufacture. This number is clearly visible and is located on top of the block where the gearbox is mounted.
Regards brett

I had a chat with Kevin an engineer recommended to me by FB_MAD (Terry)
Was very helpful however confirmed what I had suspected that, No I could not have a 327 legally....
Could go with the option of using a different chassis and re-bodying it.... but not an fc any more.
Not the first engineer now that has given me that answer. I dont think I want to go down the re-bodying road anyways.

Will have to do some reading up on the different chev capacity combinations.... 5 litres and under....
Whats everyones favorite little chev???

Cheers
John

I like the 283 and the 305, good 283's are getting hard to find.

I'm using a 1968 HK 307 in my EK sedan, I'm sure it will pull more than a grey motor would ;D ;D ;D

Just stroke it to get the capacity you're after

easy  ;D

Under the current Australian "National Code of Practice for the Construction and Modification of Light Vehicles" a modified FC special sedan can only have a maximum 268 cubic inch motor based upon the original 1094 kg vehicle.  1094kg x 4 = 4376 cc or 268 ci
An FC ute is only 1085 kg so you are looking at a slightly smaller capacity

Standard Sedan - 2389lb (1084kg)
Special Sedan - 2412lb (1094kg)
Standard Station Wagon - 2517lb (1142kg)
Special Station Wagon - 2533lb (1149kg)
Panel Van - 2415lb (1095kg)
Utility - 2393lb (1085kg)

(from the National Code of Practice)
All vehicles originally weighing between 800kg and 1100 kg -

Original weight (kg) x 4 = maximum capacity naturally aspirated
Original weight (kg) x 2.5 = maximum capacity turbo charged or super charged

regards
Weddo

Wow, what extra 10kg of stuff between the Standard and Special Sedans would only weigh 7kgs in Station Sedans?

The other reason to talk to your engineer, is most of the various registration authorities only use an "Acceptable" weight across the whole model range, for instance Queensland Transport will use the weight from the official Section LA of their standards for modified engines, and they think the following weights are right FOR ALL VARIANTS OF THE PARTICULAR MODEL:

FE:    1050kg
FC:    1070kg
FB:    1099kg
EK:    1120kg

and the formula they use for a mono constructed vehicle is
Normally Aspirated:  In Cubic Inches = Original weight (kg) X 0.294
Super Charged or Turbo Charged:  In Cubic Inches = Original Weight  (kg) X 0.244

IF your engineer thinks you have a seperate chassis construction (front subframe etc) he can also drag this set of rules into play:
Normally Aspirated:  In Cubic Inches = Original weight (kg) X 0.333
Super Charged or Turbo Charged:  In Cubic Inches = Original Weight  (kg) X 0.286


Given those regs, you could put a 314.58 ci naturally aspirated engine, or a 261.08 supercharged engine in an FC of any description. BUT every engineer you will talk to will have different ideas of what HE will certify, as it all rests squarely on his shoulders if it goes pearshaped.

Your engineer may have a different ideas and history with modified vehicles and work with you to help obtain a larger engine capacity, so obviously talk to a few engineers and find one you are comfortable with for the job, and check their reputation thoroughly.

Just my 2c worth
Matt

Those are the same formulas used in N.S.W.

                          Cheers Glenn