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Well, I finally got some time off work to have a little bit of a play with my cars.

I took the head off the engine in the EK and I found something really horrible - what looked like a pebble or something dropped out of the head when I took it off. But it was a pebble - it was actually part of number 6 piston!!! :o






What would cause the piston to break up like this?
Would retarted timing cause it?


So the option of putting the better head on this bottom end no longer exists  :'(

Oh well, at this point it looks like I'm going to put the swapmeet engine together and drop that into the EK.
Having a good look at it the pistons and bores are in good condition, and the valves in the head are much better than  those I just took off the engine in the car now.

Besides new head, manifold, rocker cover and sideplate and other gaskets, is there anything else I should be checking or replacing on the swapmeet engine before I put it into the car?


Cheers,
Ray.

I had a bit of a probe around the motor and decided that the noise was definitely coming from the top end of the motor, at the back somewhere.

I took the rocker cover off, and let the motor run. All the rocker gear seemed to be moving as it should, with no obvious broken rockers or springs.

The next step was to do a compression test.
According to the manual the first stroke should be around 75 psi, and the fourth about 115psi, with a max of 10 psi difference between cylinders.
Here were my readings

Cylinder // FIRST READING(psi) // SECOND READING(psi)
1               75                               120
2               75                               120
3               75                               120
4               75                               120
5               75                                 90
6                -                                    -

ie no compression on the last cylinder and low on #5

I squirted oil into number 5 cylinder and got
5*             75                               120

Which I guess means that the rings are gone in number 5

I squirted oil into number 6 cylinder and got
6*             5                                   30

Which I suppose means that the rings are gone in number 6, but the main problem is with the valves in number 6 ?

I haven't taken the head off yet, because at least at the moment I can still move the car around in the yard if I have to.

With the compression down in number 5 like it is, would it be worth putting another head on the motor as is, without touching the bottom end?
Or would this just be asking for trouble?

I managed to get another grey motor from a swapmeet on Sunday. It was used on a bench to run a saw, with a pulley stuck onto the end of the output shaft of the gearbox. The seller said he was getting a little bit of oil in the water. He figured it was the head gasket, so he took the head off to take a look, and thats as far as he got. I got the engine cheap, with all of the accessories.

Looking at the head and valves they all look pretty good, and the bores of the bottom end look good too.

Would it be worthwhile putting this head on the bottom end of the engine thats in the car now?
Or would I be better off putting the swapmeet engine back together?
How can I tell if this swapmeet engine is any good? What should I be looking for?
Should I just put a new headgasket on it and run it on the bench to check the compression etc?
Or can I tell the condition of the motor before putting it together?
Or should I just put new gaskets etc through the whole thing, paint it and put it in the car?

Ray.

Looks like my weekend has been mapped out for me.

Probing for noises, compression tests, rocker cover and side plate removal.

Inspecting the valve train, pushrods etc.

If I do find a stuck valve, I'll try your trick, Terry.

Otherwise, the head is coming off. :-/

The engine in this car has been sitting for a while, and it probably didn't help that the timing was retarded before I checked it over with new plugs, points etc. The distributor was out by a tooth or more.
Retarded timing leads to some scary exhaust temperatures - which kinda makes me think it may be a problem with a valve. ???

Anyway, thanks for the advice. Of course I'll let everyone know how I go on the weekend.


Ray.

10 grand!:o
Unfortunately my pockets don't go quite that deep.

Burnsy, I bought Brad's EK.
I haven't driven it to work yet, because I've had to sort out the brakes first. Now I've got an engine problem. :(

That blue FB with the airbrushed Aussie flag has been around for a while. I think he lives in Thornlie somewhere - I've seen it a fair bit around Spencer Road.
I saw it at Big Al's this year, he had it or sale for $6000. Its got a grey motor, sounds nice with extractors and twin exhausts.

TorqueFC, your engine sounds awesome. I know what you mean when you talk about cost vs reliability and cost vs nostalgia.
I've still got a mini hidden away in my shed, and I've had a few over time. Anyway try getting a Cooper S motor built to give about 100hp or so and see if you can get any change out of six grand. Oh yeah, the gearbox needs to be rebuilt at the same time (shared oil, don't want old bits of gearbox in the new engine) and you can only imagine what that would cost. :P

Thats why I prefer to play with old Holdens. :)

I have had a couple of days off work to get the brakes on the EK sorted, which I've done. Took it for a drive on Sunday night to get some dinner, and I ended up dropping it back home and getting the Commodore. The noise was that worrying.

Anyway I decided to move that car onto the lawn this morning to wash it, before I put it away into cold storage. Having a closer listen today, I don't think the noise is coming from the bottom end. Its very loud and sounds more like its coming from the top of the motor.

Maybe a stuck valve, or a broken rocker?

I suppose I can check by taking the rocker cover off and turning the motor over?

I can't just give a stuck valve a bit of a whack and hope to free it, can I?

Wouldn't it mean I'm up for a new valve, and a new head? Or at least a reground valve seat?

Maybe I'd be better off just getting the whole thing rebuilt anyway?

If its something that is not too expensive, then I can fix it or get it fixed now. Otherwise it will be a few months before I could think about a rebuild.


Ray.

The engine in my EK is making a horrible knocking noise which sounds awfully like a big end. :(

Who are some of the engine places in WA that I should be talking to?

I understand that the guy at Watmor Engines used to race greys at the speedway, but unfortunately he passed away a little while ago. Are there any other guys like this still around?

At least this gives me an excuse to build a warm grey motor.

I intend to put twin strombergs on it, and headers maybe. This is not an everyday driver, so it can be a little bit hairy.


What should I be asking for to have a streetable grey?


Ray.

You could use any ute back end from FE through to EK, because the rear lights, panels, bumpers etc are the same.

Ray.

Excellent.
Considering my current budget constraints, that sound like the way to go.

Thankyou everyone.

Ray.

So I could fit a HR rear end with the rear wheel cylinders from a drum/drum car, and later on when I put the HR front cross member in , just replace the rear wheel cylinders with the disc/drum type?

Ray.

I've actually got an EK, and I'd like to keep the grey motor in it, but I like the idea of having a ball joint front end and disc brakes.

So all I'd have to do to the HR front end is get rid of the red engine mounts, and use my existing EK outrigger then?

I guess my EK swaybay will still fit too?


Ray.

Ok, the back brakes on my EK are siezed.

My best guestimate is I'm up for a fair wack of money to replace everything.

Say around $90 for each wheel cylinder, $30 for linings, $50 or so for drums? A couple of hours of labour? I'm probably looking at four or five hundred to get it fixed, maybe?

Would it be any cheaper to replace the rear end with a HR rear?

The other question is, could I put a HR rear end on the EK without changing the front brakes, i.e. doing the rear end first and replacing the front with a HR cross member further down the track?


Ray.

Where on the HR cross member would the engine mounts have to be if retaining the grey motor?

Would the be on the front edge of the member, or somewhere different?

Ray.

Splicing into the door light switch is a good idea, but the problem is the ignition light would go out when you close the door.
I don't know about you , but I usually close my door before I put the key in the ignition.
What you want to do is wire in a delay that keeps the light on for a short time after the door is closed. You can buy kits from the electronics stores to do this.

Ray.

Umm, it would probably help if I included the link ;)

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/HOT-HOLDENS-CUSTOMS-No-1-FX-FJ-FE-FC-FB-HD_W0QQitemZ6978388360QQcategoryZ109525QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem


Ray.

I've just put issue 1 of Hot Holdens and Customs on ebay. It dates from around 1967.
Lots of custom FX's, FJ's, a couple of FC's, even an article on the Norman Supercharger!

Ray.

I believe the linkages are on the drivers side on my column shift HG, but its too cold and wet to go outside and check now.

Something else to consider is how is the torque converter mounted to the crankshaft, i.e. flex plate, flyweel etc. I know things have to be changed to convert a red motor from manual to auto. Even though a red motor gearbox mates up with a grey engine, it doesn't necessarily follow that the trimatic can be made to mate up.

For what its worth a high stall converter means that the engine has to build up more revs before the transmission will provide any drive to the rear wheels. Useful with a cammy engine, but unnecessary behind an engine with a standard cam.

Ray.

Is it possible to put a 253 into an FE?

I've heard that the Holden V8's are a problem to fit because of the width. Does anyone have some rough dimensions?

Is the 253 the same width and length as the 308?

The reason why I ask about the 253 is because of the low tare weight of my FE, 1016kg. I think that limits me to 298ci for an engine size?

I measured up the 289 in my Galaxie, width is 27 inches or so, around the same as a Holden V6. But the length is 31 inches, thats about the distance from the firewall to the radiator support panel in the FE!! That would mean chopping into the firewall to get it to fit. I think the hot rodders have the same problem when they try to fit a small block ford V8 into an model A, hence a recessed firewall, or a chevy V8 (Not withstanding the fact that small block chevs are generally cheaper to buy performance parts for).

I guess a V6 conversion would be the easier option, but I want to get the info on a V8 conversion first.

Sixes do the job, but V8's sound the business.

Ray.

What is the name of that colour on the car, or perhaps the build plate colour code?
It looks a bit like "sky grey", but I could be mistaken.

Cheers,
Ray.