what retractable seat belts are people using in their modified cars. I am looking for front and rear ideas.
fred
Fred I used VP commodore front (because I had them from the donor car) and HEMCO rear parcel shelf mounted, I did not hide the rear ones as the car was finished before my engineer informed me that I had to have retractable both front and rear.
Regards
Neil H
You cannot legally use belts from another car.
I used buckles from HK broughm and had them refurbished and brand new webbing/belt with Australian standards sewn into them.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170322/32bb6b50f4c48bdea3a50f2146ad9acd.jpg)
Quote from: NES304 on March 22, 2017, 08:49:30 PM
You cannot legally use belts from another car.
Not sure I agree with that.
If the vehicle is engineered against the NCOP, then NCOP 7 (section 5) allows that "A complying seatbelt is a seatbelt that:... has been taken from a production vehicle that complies with the ADRs". Section 2 allows "Any replacement or additional seatbelt
should be new and comply with Australian Standard 2596 (Seatbelt Assemblies for Motor Vehicles)." (my bold). The use of "should" gives the engineer leeway to certify a second-hand seatbelt from an ADR-compliant car. As always, you then need to find an engineer who is happy to grant that leeway.
When I went through the seatbelt engineering for the EK wagon project, I had to jump through a heap of hoops to keep the engineer happy. I learnt more about seatbelt mounts than I ever wanted to. I ended up with Hemco retractable belts in the front and rear outer positions, and Hemco lap belts in the two middle positions. I had to show 100% compliance to NCOP... and the ADRs that they call up. Both NCOP and the ADRs are a nightmare to understand for seatbelt anchorages... lots of maths and funny angles to work out. I took a heap of photos, and have written it up into a plain-English seatbelt Guide. It's not finished yet (the text is a little rough), but it is about 90% done. If you want a copy FreddyC send me a PM and I can email it to you.
Cheers,
Harv
I am sure I have seen somewhere on here someone made a flanged c channel plate under the rear parcel shelf, which I am guessing is so the bolt does not go through parcel shelf.
fred
So NES are you saying that your belts are not retractable I love the Brougham buckles but thought all outside belts now had to be retractable and I did think that as Harv said belt taken from other cars were ok as long as they were not frayed or damaged and locked when pulled which my engineer checked out when he can to do the final inspection.
Is this another of those areas that is so open to interpretation.
Regards
Neil H
I have a set of the flange plates that I bought from a seat belt mob in WA. They were featured in a Street Machine Magazine. I sure Nes posted it on his build. I am not using them now. They cost $150 which I thought was a bit rich, if you want them you can make me an offer.
Cheers Ole
Neil They ARE retractable.
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Sorry NES the way I read it I thought they were old school now I understand that's a cool idea making them look original mate.
Regards
Neil H
My engineer suggested non retractable in the back due to the ease of installation for the wagon.
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whealy I have retractable in my wagon, they just bolt to wheel arch.
fred
Hey freddyc,
Could you please post some photos. I was trying to do the same
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I'm pretty sure other than central passengers all corners of the car need inertia reels
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Quote from: NES304 on March 25, 2017, 10:28:36 PM
I'm pretty sure other than central passengers all corners of the car need inertia reels
I'm not sure I agree with this. The NCOP guidance makes no requirement for inertia belts. The only mention it makes is when additional seats are added (eg into the cargo area of a station wagon). Even then, it has leeway:
"Where additional seats are to be fitted (e.g. into a van or station wagon) the Vehicle Standards Bulletin VSB 5A, Commercial Manufacture and Installation of Additional Seats or Vehicle Standards Bulletin VSB 5B Construction and Installation of Additional Seats by Individuals apply.
Note: This will generally mean that Retractor Belts will need to be fitted. Installation of retractor assemblies require careful attention to detail and therefore must be installed
as directed by the seatbelt assembly manufacturer. Incorrect installation may result in the assembly not operating as intended."VS5B indicates that:
"Some registering authorities may require retractor type (inertia reel) belts to be fitted for all additional outboard seating positions and this should be checked with your local authority before proceeding. In those States or Territories where retractor belts are not mandated it is strongly recommended that they be installed.".So in short, it depends on the States rego authority. As an example, NSW will accept non-retractor belts - I have new, non-retractor belts in all six seating positions in my bog-stock FB daily driver. The belts were certified by an RMS Authorised Restraint Fitting Station.
Cheers,
Harv
whealy pm me you number again.
fred
Hi guys
Seat belts seem to be another of those areas where there is interpretation of the rules as Harv has said.
From my experience:- I was talking to my engineer just before he came for the final sign off, we were going through the tick off list when he asked me what belts I had in the back, at the time I had non retractable, he told me I had to have retractables on all corners.
I've wondered if this was because I had changed to buckets in the front where maybe the rule which says "when additional seats are fitted" it is a bit confusing.
I would have assumed that a bog standard vehicle would not have to comply.
Just my 2 cents worth
Regards
Neil H
Bugger me Harv! It cost me extra to have mine re done as inertia but I am really happy I did. A lot neater too
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Quote from: NES304 on March 27, 2017, 04:50:26 PM
Bugger me Harv! It cost me extra to have mine re done as inertia but I am really happy I did. A lot neater too
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Agree. The inertia belts may not be always required by law, but do make life a lot easier. Having lived with the non-inertia belts in the FB daily driver for a few years now, I'd personally install inertia belts if I have a choice.
Cheers,
Harv
I used Hemco belts in my wagon from Stamps Seat Belts here in Vic.
Rear inertia belts fitted out of site , images on my build thread now in finished projects may be useful for ideas.
Ian.
Harv, where did you find those articles?
Quote from: LimeSoda on May 11, 2017, 06:09:07 PM
Harv, where did you find those articles?
The NCOP documents are here:
https://infrastructure.gov.au/roads/vehicle_regulation/bulletin/vsb_ncop.aspx
I have a copy of VSB 5B that I downloaded years ago. It is harder to find online, as it appears there are moves afoot to merge VSB 5A and 5B. Here is a draft of the combined Bulletin (VSB.05) that covers the content of VSB 5B:
https://infrastructure.gov.au/roads/vehicle_regulation/bulletin/files/VSB5.pdf
Cheers,
Harv
Any chance of detailed photos of the seat belts Ian?
Nice. Thanks a lot, Harv.